Pamay Bassey
Chief Learning & Diversity Officer at The Kraft Heinz Company
Learn to Lead
Episode Summary
What does it take to be a successful leader? On Episode 131 of the Keep Leading!® podcast, I interviewed Pamay Bassey, the Chief Learning and Diversity Officer for the Kraft Heinz Company, for the answer. Simply put? Pamay says you must LEARN to lead. Listen to this episode to discover why being a lifelong learner is inextricably linked to effective leadership.
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Bio
Ekpedeme “Pamay” M. Bassey is Chief Learning and Diversity Officer for the Kraft Heinz Company, where she drives a culture of continuous learning, bold creativity, and intellectual curiosity, is responsible for the company’s global learning and development strategy and initiatives and amplifies the work that every Kraft Heinz employee does to create and nurture a diverse and inclusive workplace.
A lifelong learner who loves laughter, words, big ideas, and serving her community, Pamay knows the power of doing big things in small increments. She believes that learning can be a superpower that can transform people, families, communities, and organizations. This belief is demonstrated in her passion projects that, for over a decade, have focused on the ways people believe, worship, lead, and learn.
Her TEDx talk and weekly journal, both named Navigating Sacred Spaces, are based on her project work and her book: My 52 Weeks of Worship: Lessons from a Global, Spiritual, Interfaith Journey. She has also authored a daily journal: Let’s Learn Our Way Through It, Shall We? — which encourages others to commit to their own personal and professional learning journeys.
Pamay is a graduate of Stanford, Northwestern, and the Second City Conservatory.
LinkedIn
https://www.linkedin.com/in/pamay/
Leadership Quote
Play the scene you are in, not the one you want to be in.
Get Your Copy of Pamay’s Book!
https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/0578906627/ref=dbs_a_def_rwt_bibl_vppi_i1
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Transcript
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This podcast is part of the C Suite Radio Network, turning the volume up on business.
Welcome to the Keep Leading!® Podcast, the podcast dedicated to promoting leadership development and sharing leadership insights. Here’s your host, The Leadership Excelerator®, Eddie Turner.
Eddie Turner:
Hello, everyone. Welcome to the Keep Leading!® Podcast, the podcast dedicated to leadership development and insights. I’m your host Eddie Turner, The Leadership Excelerator®. I work with leaders to accelerate performance and drive impact through the power of executive coaching, masterful facilitation, and professional speaking.
What does it take to be a successful leader? My guest today says you must be a learner first. Then you can lead. Going further, she says you must be a lifelong learner. Today, we will discuss why you must learn to lead.
My guest today is Pamay Bassey. Pamay is the Chief Learning and Diversity Officer for the Kraft Heinz Company where she drives a culture of continuous learning, both creativity and intellectual curiosity. She is responsible for the company’s global learning and development strategy and initiatives and amplifies the work that every Kraft Heinz employee does to create and nurture a diverse and inclusive workspace. Pamay is also a graduate of Stanford and Northwestern Universities and the Second City Conservatory.
Pamay, welcome to the Keep Leading!® Podcast.
Pamay Bassey:
Hey, Eddie. Thank you so much for having me.
Eddie Turner:
And it’s not often I get to have a fellow Northwestern Wildcat on the show.
Pamay Bassey:
Go Cats!
Eddie Turner:
I don’t think I ever have. So, yes, Go Cats!
Pamay Bassey:
Fantastic. We could have an anu moment. No problem with that.
Eddie Turner:
Oh, we must. We absolutely must.
Well, Pamay, tell us more about you.
Pamay Bassey:
Goodness. You mentioned lifelong learning and laughter. Well, you mentioned Second City which is a well-known, I think, theater in Chicago that focuses on improv and theater and laughter and comedy rather. Those two things really define me. I’m a lifelong learner. I like laughter. Words, I’m a writer, big ideas and serving my community. And so, all of those things, if you look at the way I spend my time and the things that I do to make my life delicious, they’re connected to one of those things.
Eddie Turner:
Well, for those who don’t know what Second City is and some of the people who’ve left Second City, can you just share that with us, please?
Pamay Bassey:
Second City … Chicago is a Mecca, if you will, for improv, improvisational comedy. And so many people, if you are a fan of sketch comedy, Saturday Night Live, some stand-up comedians and actors have come through Second City. And so, it’s a real amazing place where a lot of great actors and comedians were trained and some of the people who you probably are entertained by on a regular basis have a connection to Second City.
Eddie Turner:
Indeed. Now, to give folks a profile in just who you are, here you are this deeply intellectual woman with degrees from Stanford and Northwestern University but there’s this other side of you that loves to laugh. And so, you graduate from Second City as an improv comedian.
Pamay Bassey:
It’s true. I mean, laughter is at the core of who I am and I like to say that I try to find humor in everything. And so, I try to find the things that are hilarious about life. And when I cannot find things that are funny and life is challenging, then I just try to figure out “Well, let me learn my way through this. What can I learn from the situation?” So, either I’m enjoying things and laughing hysterically or I’m really focusing on what the lesson is in whatever happens to be going on at the moment.
Eddie Turner:
Interesting. When you can’t laugh about it, you learn about it.
Pamay Bassey:
Absolutely.
Eddie Turner:
Tell me what motivated you to become such a passionate promoter of learning.
Pamay Bassey:
I think my story, really, if I look back, and this is a hindsight is absolutely 20:20, but I started school very early. I was four when I started first grade which is, I think, in most places early, sometimes earlier than others. I’m from Atlanta. I ended up going to college very early. And so, I was always the early bird and I was told repeatedly …
Eddie Turner:
How early?
Pamay Bassey:
I went to college at 16.
Eddie Turner:
Wow!
Pamay Bassey:
So, I was a freshman at Stanford when I was 16 which, at the time, I thought was perfectly normal because I was ready to go to college but in hindsight, wow! That’s super young …
Eddie Turner:
That’s impressive, Pamay. Very impressive.
Pamay Bassey:
… across the country to go to school. And so, throughout my young educational career, I was told I was smart a lot and then when I got to Stanford, I was ready to go. And I was immediately humbled by the classes that I took. I knew I wanted to study AI which required me to take advanced math classes and physics classes. And my first calculus class and my first coding class humbled me completely and I really had to rethink the assessment that others had had made of me that I was intelligent. I made it through school, I made it to grad school, etc. but I still had a very altered perception of what it meant for me to be smart. And I realize now, and that was because I primarily had a fixed mindset, and a fixed mindset for those who are not familiar with the idea of a fixed mindset or a growth mindset is that either you’re smart or you’re not, either you can do something or you can’t, but what I’ve done since then has moved into really having that growth mindset. And the growth mindset is saying “You know what? You can learn your way through anything. If you have a little bit of grit and you have a little persistence and you create a learning practice, it’s not about innate intelligence only. It’s about being able to create an environment where you can learn something new.” And so, that has been kind of the arc of my life as a learner and I’ve created a career based on kind of curiosity and a real passion around helping people understand that they can learn their way through whatever it is whether it be a life situation or a job situation that it’s not about can you do it or can’t you do it. It’s about what do you need to learn in order to be successful in that situation.
Eddie Turner:
I like that perspective. Can you share with us a time in your career or your life where you had a situation that you had to manifest this grit and tenacity you’re talking about to learn your way through a challenge to be successful?
Pamay Bassey:
Goodness, it happens so often. There are situations. I was in consulting for a long time and when you’re in consulting, I mean, certainly I had an expertise around being an instructional designer or a learning designer but every time you walk into a new client and you’re learning a new industry, you really have to sit and think “What are the rules here? Who are the people who are in charge? How are decisions made?” And certainly, as a learning designer, as you’re trying to figure out how to teach something to someone else, often you have to immerse yourself in that content and figure out what are the questions that you want to ask experts that will help you to create engaging learning environments. The answer is how often do I not have to do that to walk into a new situation and realize that I’m about to climb another learning curve and then have the conversation with myself that “It’s okay. You can learn your way through this. Focus on moving from where you are to where you need to be from not knowing to knowing.” It’s a constant practice. It’s happened to me across my career repeatedly.
Eddie Turner:
Well, I think it speaks to what you said earlier in terms of not having a fixed mindset and having a growth mindset. I admire you for recognizing and having the awareness that you need to be willing to learn and go learn in these scenarios where some people, they are going to come in and try to tackle it the same way they tackled everything else and not try to learn something new because of being fixed on one perspective, one point of view. And the difference that you see in outcomes is demonstrably different.
Pamay Bassey:
I would agree with that I mean, there’s a humility with knowing that you cannot know everything. The more you know, I think, the more you realize that. And so, when we talk about at Kraft Heinz, for example, wanting to create that culture of intellectual curiosity, how can you be curious about what you don’t know, how can you be thoughtful about new ways to tackle old problems, I think it’s something that personally is important and professionally also important to really retain that humility in order to continue to learn and grow.
Eddie Turner:
Now, as an executive coach, there are times that I work with clients and they have not picked up a new book since they left high school or since they left college. People driving in their vehicles or listening to our show can’t see your home but I saw your home before we started this show and no one could accuse you of not having picked up a book since college. Your entire wall is filled with books that aren’t decoration. I know you’ve read them.
Pamay Bassey:
I do love to read. I mean, I always have and I grew up in a family where I have three sisters. Dr. and Mrs. Bassey were pretty strict. And so, books provided the opportunity for me to go out and about in the world but I couldn’t actually go out and about in the real world. And so, I do have a love for books. I’m a writer now. I love to write books but certainly, I mean, one of the best ways to expand your horizons is to read and read voraciously.
Eddie Turner:
And this is part of your construct on lifelong learning.
Pamay Bassey:
I would agree with that, yeah, is to take in the information, learn something new every day even if it’s just a few minutes, whether it’s reading a book or … I’m in L&D. So, it might be an e-learning class. It might be a podcast such as this one. There are so many different ways to take in new information and really making a practice of that so you’re learning something new every day and then figuring out ways to apply that in whatever challenges you may have, whatever situations you may find yourself in. So, yeah, absolutely part of how I walk through the world.
Eddie Turner:
What makes this important for leaders?
Pamay Bassey:
Leaders should absolutely be learners. I think definitely for leaders, modeling what it looks like to be a lifelong learner helps make it clear to those who may be on your team that it’s important for them. I mean, I have my Chief People Officer who I work for, she sends me articles, she’ll say “Hey, take a look at this. What do you think?” My CEO will send articles or links to things and saying “Take a look at this.” And so, I do the same to my team. My team sends it to me. So, I think to be a leader, it’s important to take in information and really take the time to reflect on … I always say “Is this for me? Is it for somebody who might be reporting to me? Is it for my peers?” to share what you’re learning with others. And then you end up creating what we call a culture of generosity because “Hey, you know what? I read this article. It’s not really relevant to what I’m working on but, you know what, Eddie? I know you’re working on X, Y, and Z and I think it might be important for you.” And so, that exchange of ideas as a leader and a leader among leaders becomes very valuable.
Eddie Turner:
And you set the example for your organization. And I absolutely love what you just shared. Can you share with us a recent undertaking that you did for the entire Kraft Heinz Company?
Pamay Bassey:
There are so many. I mean, the last thing that just happened is we had a 24-hour learning marathon, we call it Owner Varsity Day. Owner Varsity is our corporate university and it’s named to align with one of our corporate values which is “We own it.” So, ownership is very important. And as you mentioned, I’m Chief Learning and Diversity Officer, in the spirit of creating a diverse and inclusive workplace, wanting to make sure that we had an around-the-clock learning experience so that everybody could be included in that learning experience based on one theme and they could have interactions with those who came and shared their thought leadership or their expertise in their own time zone so often when there’s a global company asking certain people to listen to things in the middle of the night while others are able to watch things during their day but with a 24-hour learning marathon, we were able to make sure that everybody had the chance to learn something in their own daylight. And it was amazing. We opened with Adam Grant we closed with Priya Parker. Our leaders shared their thoughts and we had sessions around our purpose and our values around things like design thinking and psychological safety. So, really just providing the organization with an opportunity to learn together and grow together and that’s just one of the things that we’ve done most recently at Kraft Heinz.
Eddie Turner:
And I think that’s so important, not only the undertaking but that you did it to allow people to learn when it was convenient for them and that would be stressful for them because they live in a different part of the world.
Pamay Bassey:
Absolutely.
Eddie Turner:
And you had a campaign that, I think, you called it “Learn like an owner” or “Learn like a leader”?
Pamay Bassey:
“Learn like an owner.” You’re absolutely right. And that’s the foundation of all of that. I mean, frankly, when I joined Kraft Heinz as a brand-new Chief Learning Officer, a few weeks after I started, I created a value proposition for learning and development and it said that we expected our employees to learn like an owner so that they could execute with excellence, accelerate their learning curve and grow a great career. And that first piece “learn like an owner” was focused on encouraging people to own their own learning and development, so really to say “What can I do so that I am the one who owns that?” and based on asking people to seek out high-impact learning experiences to commit to a learning practice even if it was just for a few minutes a day and to encourage others to do the same. So, if they were individual contributors, they may be encouraging their peers. If they’re people managers encouraging their teams or senior leaders, influencing others and really encouraging everyone to contribute to a culture of learning. And now we are starting our fourth year of kind of the “learn like an owner” movement but really at the very beginning, it was me making a decision to learn something new every day for 365 days and share that with my organization so that, again, as a learning leader, modeling what it looks like to learn like an owner, to have a learning practice to be a lifelong learner and letting that example drive others to make the same choice, inspire others in some case and serve as a foundation for the revitalization of our learning culture at Kraft Heinz.
Eddie Turner:
Fascinating. Thank you for sharing.
Pamay Bassey:
Sure.
Eddie Turner:
I’m talking to Pamay Bassey. She’s the Chief Learning and Diversity Officer for the Kraft Heinz Company. She is also an author, speaker, coach, comedian, writer and educator. We’ll have more with Pamay right after this.
This podcast is sponsored by Eddie Turner LLC. Organizations who need to accelerate the development of their leaders call Eddie Turner, The Leadership Excelerator®. Eddie works with leaders to accelerate performance and drive impact. Call Eddie Turner to help your leaders one on one as their coach or to inspire them as a group through the Power of facilitation or a keynote address. Visit EddieTurnerLLC.com to learn more.
Hi. This is Chester Elton, the Apostle of Appreciation, and you’re listening to the Keep Leading!® Podcast with the one, the only Eddie Turner.
Eddie Turner:
We’re back. I’m talking to Pamay Bassey. Pamay Bassey is the Chief Learning and Diversity Officer for the Kraft Heinz Company. She is an author, speaker, coach, comedian, writer and educator. She has also given a TED Talk, a TED Talk that has millions of views. Definitely, check it out. By the way, tell us what the TED Talk was about, Pamay.
Pamay Bassey:
So, my TEDx Talk was called “navigating sacred spaces.” And it’s funny, we were talking about my learning project “365 days of learning” but before that came a project called “My 52 weeks of worship.” I like projects. And so, this was the first one that I spent a year having made a personal commitment to visit a different place of worship every week for that year, so churches and mosques and synagogues and temples from the south side of Chicago to South Africa from Brazil to Brooklyn. And after a year of navigating sacred spaces, I had the opportunity to write my first book about it called “My 52 Weeks of Worship.” And then I had the opportunity to do a TED Talk about it. And so, it really is a short rendition of all of the things that I learned over that year, navigating sacred spaces. I mean the project has continued for over a decade and I did it again in Brooklyn and continue to learn and grow. And I also talk about it being the foundation of my inclusion practice. And so, we talk about being Chief Learning and Diversity Officer, part of that effort in diversity, inclusion and belonging really is being humble enough to walk into spaces that you may not be familiar with to talk to people who may have different lived experiences than you do and learn, learn what you have in common, learn what’s completely different, figure out how to learn about yourself and your relationship to people who are different than you and be an inclusive leader and be someone who contributes to creating and nurturing an inclusive workplace. And that all kind of started with my first project “My 52 weeks of worship” and that’s what I talk about in my TED Talk.
Eddie Turner:
And I should let people know that it is a TEDx Talk you gave but it had so many views and was so powerful that it was elevated to the TED platform. That’s a huge accomplishment that very few people get.
Pamay Bassey:
It is a delight. Every time I can tell my story, I’m delighted that that was something that happened to my words. And so, yeah, absolutely it was something that I will never forget, a really great accomplishment for me and for my story.
Eddie Turner:
Yeah, it’s phenomenal. I mean, that’s something that everyone wants to have who’s ever given a TEDx Talk. And that just speaks to the impact that you had and are continuing to have on the globe. So, kudos to you.
Pamay Bassey:
Thank you, Eddie.
Eddie Turner:
Now, you moved beyond that book and you wrote a new book that was released in August of 2021. Tell us the title and tell us about it.
Pamay Bassey:
Sure. So, my new book is called Let’s Learn Our Way Through It, Shall We? And it’s a daily journal, again, supporting people and organizations in creating that learning practice. So, literally, as I went through my year of learning something new every day for 365 days, after that was over, I sat and I thought and I created a list of 365 things I learned over that year of learning. And then it became this journal where you’re able to read the things that I learned and then you’re able to think about them and journal about them. And so, really, it’s an opportunity for people to have their own learning practice hopefully inspire them. Whether it’s for 30 days or 60 days or a quarter or a year, the part of that learning journey that is super impactful is really reflecting on what you learned, sometimes writing about it and then perhaps sharing it. And so, my new book allows people to learn what I learned over that year of learning and then take the opportunity to create their own learning practice to journal what they’ve learned. And then at the back of the book, I literally list every single person I learned from in the span of that year. And so, if you really wanted to do further research on some of the things that are in my book, you’re able to do that as well.
Eddie Turner:
That’s phenomenal. Very, very impressive work that you’re doing. And what would you say, Pamay, has been something you learned that you hold near and dear to your heart that you feel really impacts you as a leader and guides how you lead?
Pamay Bassey:
One of the things that I learned along the way is the concept of deep work. And there’s a professor Cal Newport, I believe, from Georgetown, if I’m not mistaken, who talks about really spending your time aligning your time with your priorities. I mean, these days there are so many distractions. My inbox, all of our inboxes are full to the brim, and if you watch the kind of the notifications on your various devices, you could spend the whole day in reactive mode but the idea of carving out time to do deep work, I think, is one that kept popping up for me during that year of learning and one that I still continue to try to honor. And so, that’s one. You pair that with the idea of knowing your Einstein window and that is what time during the day are you most effective. For me, it’s super early in the morning. And so, I try to save my deep work for my Einstein window. And so, anywhere from 5 to 8 in the morning, instead of diving into my inbox, I spend time trying to do strategic work or deep thinking or writing or whatever it is that I find to be most important to me. So, those are actually two of the things that I’ve learned along my year of learning that I continue to try to honor.
Eddie Turner:
I love the way you call that window your Einstein window.
Pamay Bassey:
Yeah, not my words. I learned that from an article that I read over that year of learning but I love it because that’s the time where you’re on, you’re focused, you’re optimistic, you’re hopeful, you’re alert and you should use that time for the most important work that you’re doing.
Eddie Turner:
Yeah, I’ve heard about creating that kind of window. I just love that label. I’m going to use that.
Pamay Bassey:
Good stuff.
Eddie Turner:
Pamay, I could talk to you for hours. What’s the main message you would like to convey to our listeners?
Pamay Bassey:
I think the most important thing is that no matter what it is, you can learn your way through it. And often you’re in situations where you think “Ah, maybe that’s not for me” or “maybe I can’t do that.” And if you focus on the fact that “You know what? Learning is sometimes difficult and sometimes challenging but it can always get you from where you are to where you want to be.” And especially at this time in the world where everything is changing, there’s so much ambiguity, everyone’s trying to figure out what the next normal is going to look like post-pandemic or wherever we are in this pandemic cycle, it really is embracing the fact that learning can be your superpower, can help you to get through whatever may be ahead of you, whatever challenges personally or professionally that may be in store for you. So, I would just leave that as a motivational message.
Eddie Turner:
That is a motivational message. And here on the Keep Leading!® Podcast, I always like to know what is a piece of advice or a quote that you use that helps you to keep leading.
Pamay Bassey:
One of my favorite lessons from “My 365” is the idea of resting or acting. So, I tell myself, especially when there’s a long to-do list and many things are on my mind, either rest or act. If you’re scrolling through things or you’re ruminating “Nope,” either you rest or you act. And sometimes, that’s for me the most important thing that helps me to understand that it’s okay to take a break if you’re not being productive. It’s just as important to rest as it is to work really hard. So, rest or act is a mantra of mine.
Eddie Turner:
Excellent.
Pamay Bassey:
So, people often ask me what I’ve learned from being an improviser which is something that was transformative for me studying at Second City. And the idea as an improviser, if you’ve been to a show, the actor will ask the audience for a suggestion and then they have to do something with that suggestion. They can’t say “Oh, I don’t like that suggestion. Give me another one.” And so, most people know yes and that’s one improv kind of tenet but the idea to play the scene you’re in, not the scene you want to be in, that is whatever is given to you, then that’s the scene. And so, whether it be a gift or a challenge or a circumstance or a constraint, you can wish it’s different or you can address it as it is. And so, often, especially in this ever-changing world, and my team knows it, I say it all the time and now I have team members who are also saying, play the scene you’re in, not the one you want to be in. And that allows you to face the challenge head on and be creative and tackle it and make something happen with whatever you’re given. So, that is also a life mantra of mine.
Eddie Turner:
I like that. Thank you for those two pieces of advice that will help us all to keep leading in work and in life.
Where can my listeners learn more about you, Pamay?
Pamay Bassey:
Well, certainly, I’m very active on LinkedIn. So, please look me up. Pamay is my name. There are not too many of me in the world. I also have a website Pamay.com. So, you can find me there as well.
Eddie Turner:
Wonderful. We’re going to put that in the show notes to make it easy for people to find you. Folks, you want to connect to Pamay Bassey. She is just an exemplary woman who’s doing some fantastic work around the globe as we’ve discussed and truly will help you and I both learn to lead.
Pamay, thank you for being a guest today.
Pamay Bassey:
Thank you so much for the opportunity, Eddie.
Eddie Turner:
And thank you for listening. That concludes this episode, everyone. I am Eddie Turner, The Leadership Excelerator®, reminding you that leadership is not about our title or our position. Leadership is an activity. Leadership is action. It’s not the case of once a leader, always a leader. It’s not a garment we put on and take off. We must be a leader at our core and allow it to emanate in all we do. So, whatever you’re doing, always keep leading.
Thank you for listening to your host Eddie Turner on the Keep Leading!® Podcast. Please remember to subscribe to the Keep Leading!® Podcast on iTunes or wherever you listen. For more information about Eddie Turner’s work, please visit EddieTurnerLLC.com.
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The Keep Leading!® podcast is for people passionate about leadership. It is dedicated to leadership development and insights. Join your host Eddie Turner, The Leadership Excelerator® as he speaks with accomplished leaders and people of influence across the globe as they share their journey to leadership excellence. Listen as they share leadership strategies, techniques and insights. For more information visit eddieturnerllc.com or follow Eddie Turner on Twitter and Instagram at @eddieturnerjr. Like Eddie Turner LLC on Facebook. Connect with Eddie Turner on LinkedIn.