Lisa Spinelli
Senior Content Manager for the Association for Talent Development (ATD)
Communicating Like a Leader
Episode Summary
Some leaders think leadership is about communicating in a top-down manner. Is that the most effective way to communicate like a leader? In Episode 116 of the Keep Leading!® Podcast, Communications Expert Lisa Spinelli explains that leaders are more effective when using a coaching approach. Communicating like a coach allows leaders to communicate like a leader.
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Bio
Lisa is a Senior Content Manager at the Association for Talent Development (ATD) and the host of The Accidental Trainer podcast. She is also the creator and manager of the transitioning service member workshops, Troops to Trainers, and editor/contributor of the book Teachers to Trainers (ATD Press, 2020). Lisa is currently working toward her ACC coaching certification to serve others in their career journeys better. She is a proud veteran spouse and mother to three amazing little divas.
Website
http://lisaspinelli.com/
Other Website
https://www.td.org/user/about/LisaSpinelli
LinkedIn
https://www.linkedin.com/in/lisamspinelli/
Twitter
https://twitter.com/atdcareerdev
Leadership Quote
Integrity is choosing courage over comfort.” or “Be as passionate about listening as you are about being heard.” – Brene Brown
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https://www.td.org/books/teachers-to-trainers
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Transcript
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This podcast is part of the C Suite Radio Network, turning the volume up on business.
Welcome to the Keep Leading!® Podcast, the podcast dedicated to promoting leadership development and sharing leadership insights. Here’s your host, The Leadership Excelerator®, Eddie Turner.
Eddie Turner:
Hello, everyone! Welcome to the
Keep Leading!® Podcast, the podcast dedicated to leadership development and insights. I’m your host Eddie Turner, The Leadership Excelerator®. I work with leaders to accelerate performance and drive impact through the power of executive coaching, masterful facilitation, and motivational speaking.
Some leaders think leadership is about communicating top down. Is top-down communication the most effective form of communication as a leader? My guest today says no. My guest today says leaders are more effective when they use a coaching style for communicating. Using a coaching style is more effective and provides a whole new structure for communication that enriches a company’s culture and employee-leader relationships. My guest today who explained to us how to communicate like a leader is Lisa Spinelli. Lisa is a senior content manager at the Association for Talent Development. Many know that as ATD. And she’s also the host of the Accidental Trainer Podcast for ATD. Here with me today, I’m super excited to welcome Lisa Spinelli to the Keep Leading!® Podcast.
Hi, Lisa!
Lisa Spinelli:
Hi, Eddie! How are you doing?
Eddie Turner:
I’m well. Thank you for being here.
Lisa Spinelli:
Thank you so much for having me. It’s a real pleasure to be on here.
Eddie Turner:
It’s such a pleasure to have you. Can you tell my listeners a little bit more about you, Lisa?
Lisa Spinelli:
Oh, my goodness, where to start. Okay, I have worked at ATD for about three years. I am a reformed journalist and content manager for business to business type of organizations. I created and managed the transitioning service member workshops Troops to Trainers and because apparently, I’m kind of redundant in my titles for things, I’m also the editor and main contributor for the book Teachers to Trainers and that published in October 2020. So, I’m working towards my ACC Coaching Certification and I’m just trying to be a part of this great career development talent development community.
Eddie Turner:
Wonderful. Well, I absolutely am passionate about the field of talent development and you working for our premier organization in the field is what makes me want to talk to you. That and you’re just pretty cool. I’ve enjoyed some of the work that you’ve been doing – your show, your podcast, and then also you manage the content. So, a lot of what we’re seeing comes from you.
Lisa Spinelli:
Yes, me and a whole team of content managers are putting together that wonderful ATD content that you’re seeing that could be videos or conference speakers or webcasts, blogs, books. So, there’s a team definitely and I’m not the only one but, yes, I do love being a part of ATD and all things to do with their content.
Eddie Turner:
Yes. And I know that oftentimes we see those who are managing social media channels or … it’s just nice to peek behind the lens a little bit and to meet the person who’s making it happen because you also are the face of the ATD career portal.
Lisa Spinelli:
Yes, thank you. Yeah, I am there front and center.
Eddie Turner:
Yes. And so, folks who are looking for their next opportunity, folks who are looking to develop, it’s not just about necessarily content but Lisa publishes daily new opportunities that organizations have posted and made available.
Now, your background as a journalist, you just aren’t any journalists. Tell us where you received your journalism degree from.
Lisa Spinelli:
Yes, I went to Columbia University, the Graduate School of Journalism, graduated in 2004, which really dates me and now I’m going to have to go do something cool and fun to make myself feel younger.
Eddie Turner:
Well, the young people on campus that I coach are telling me that I’ve got to put on a Tik-Tok video if I want any kind of …
Lisa Spinelli:
Oh yeah. I don’t know how to do that. Definitely don’t even know where to start with that one.
Eddie Turner:
I haven’t figured it out either and I’m reticent to even think about it. So, I’m still officially not cool according to them.
Lisa Spinelli:
That’s too bad. I think you’re pretty cool.
Eddie Turner:
Oh, well, thank you, Lisa. Yeah. So, I love the fact that you are a journalist by training and I will tell you that I have a lot more respect for the field, the profession of journalism because of my mentor. He was an accountant by trade but he spent a lot of time in journalism classes. When he was younger, he was the editor of his college newspaper and such. He talked about the value of the training you receive as a journalist to his work even today as the partner of a prestigious firm. He writes and communicates far better than any of his peers so much so he actually teaches a writing course as a result. And so, when I went back to school as an adult, I took maybe two or three journalism classes because of what he told me. He’s absolutely right. Any time spent in a journalism course is truly life-changing and beneficial for leaders everywhere.
Lisa Spinelli:
Yeah, it’s really amazing to me. The skills that I’ve learned from interviewing and listening and researching in journalism, it can be applied to so many other professions like trainers, instructional designers, leaders, managers. I mean, yeah, there’s coaches. There’s definitely a lot of overlap in those areas.
Eddie Turner:
Indeed. And now, you’ve used your expertise to work for magazines and you’ve done a lot of very high-profile work in addition to what you’re doing for ATD but you now help other leaders to understand that communication is crucial to how they show up. So, tell us about that.
Lisa Spinelli:
Right. I kind of try to marry, like we said, the journalism skills and the communication knowledge and just put it out there not necessarily just for what people classically think as leaders because I think there’s maybe a misconception a lot of the times that leaders are only people in positions of power in an organization but you could be a leader as a team member. You can be a leader in your community. You can be a leader in so many different aspects of your life that you don’t necessarily have to be an executive, let’s say, or in the C-suite to be considered a leader. And communication, I mean, you can’t find an instance where communication is not key towards the development and the furthering of relationships, right? So, it’s definitely a big passion of mine to relay the more constructive ways to communicate.
Eddie Turner:
Would you say that communication is one of the most overlooked skills for leaders today?
Lisa Spinelli:
I think that it’s definitely not emphasized enough. I think people are starting to talk about it a lot more nowadays especially after COVID hit but are they doing it right? I don’t know that they’re doing it right. I don’t know that I’ve heard “Wow! Leaders are just really nailing this communication down with their team members.” I don’t hear that. I don’t know, Eddie. Are you hearing that?
Eddie Turner:
No, I hear that more is needed.
Lisa Spinelli:
Definitely, definitely. We talk a lot about how soft skills are really being emphasized nowadays, the empathy piece, adaptability, resilience. And I feel like communication has to be at the core of all of those. So, yes, I think maybe we’re not talking about communication enough when we’re talking about the skills development for leaders.
Eddie Turner:
What are two types of communication we need to be concerned about?
Lisa Spinelli:
Oh, there’s so many. Yeah, I think none of them are necessarily evil in and of themselves. I think not having the self-awareness around your communication style is what trips people up, right? So, if you have a very bold communication style or you have an aggressive communication style, it’s not that you can’t be blunt, you can’t be a little bit more up in people’s face than perhaps a more passive communicator but knowing your audience, knowing your limits knowing, the situation is going to definitely spin that style in a way that’s going to be more appealing and effective and productive rather than shoot yourself in the foot.
Eddie Turner:
So, you’re talking about the interpersonal communication. You’re talking about the self-awareness component. So, sometimes that involves what we say as communicators. Is there any area about what we write to be concerned about in our communication?
Lisa Spinelli:
Oh, sure. Right now, I think whether you’re writing or you’re talking to people, during COVID everybody’s become very transactional, right? We’ve seen this a lot more since people have started working fully remote. So, people are not going down and just walking down the hallway and reaching out to their staff members, hanging out with their team. They’re just becoming super transactional and short. And so, we’re losing that personal touch, that emotional connection to people. And there’s not a lot of open, honest co-active listening and learning from each other. So, that’s definitely an area of growth that we need to get back to and we need to grow in that area as well.
Eddie Turner:
What would that look like?
Lisa Spinelli:
Well, you pulled a coaching move on me right there, didn’t you? See? You know what I’m talking about. Yeah, what would that look like? That would look like more thoughtful check-ins. That would look like engaging your employees and your staff and your colleagues honestly more often. I know people, they’ve got virtual fatigue, right? We all are getting that but even if you’re not picking up the phone, even if you’re just checking in over whatever chat function your organization has, just to say hi, I know it’s crazy because right now nobody is basically reaching out to non-family and close friends anymore to just say “Hi. Hey, checking in. Haven’t talked to you in a long time,” see what’s going on with that whole person, be your transparent and authentic self and just reach out and foster those lines of communication so when there is a problem that it’s not “Oh, I haven’t heard from you in two months” and all of a sudden you’re knocking down my door with something that you need or an issue that you need addressed.
Eddie Turner:
Yes, very good, very good. Yeah, I asked that because for those who may be listening, they genuinely may wonder “Well, yes, what would that look like and what steps can I take?” So, thank you for identifying that. Those who have a lack of self-awareness as a communicator, they may not know what that first step should be. So, you’re right. Checking in on people, dialing up our empathy a little bit more, post COVID we need a lot more communication and a lot more self-awareness perhaps than we’ve ever needed.
Lisa Spinelli:
Definitely, yeah. And I think because we are working in this remote environment, it is so much easier to fall into the trap of blunt transactional type of communication and emails and meetings and then you have to run to the next thing, you got to go pick up your kid from camp, you got to go you know run and take care of another meeting that’s going to happen over Zoom or whatever it is. You just don’t have the time, it feels like. I know people think we got back like all this time but I don’t really feel like I have all this time anymore.
Eddie Turner:
Yes, it seems as though we have more time because we’re not commuting to work but we’re using that time we would have commuted to still do more work. So, it isn’t as if necessarily in some cases we gained more time.
Lisa Spinelli:
No. Yeah, I feel like now the lines have been so blurred which I know this is a big pain point for a lot of people but, yeah, we don’t have any more time. No more me time, that’s for sure.
Eddie Turner:
So, leaders need to be more aware of how they’re communicating verbally and in writing and to use the power of communication as a leader to inspire their people and support their people now and post pandemic.
Eddie Turner:
I’m having a fantastic conversation with Lisa Spinelli. Lisa Spinelli is a senior content manager at the Association for Talent Development and she’s the host of the Accidental Trainer Podcast.
We’ll have more with Lisa right after this.
This podcast is sponsored by Eddie Turner LLC. Organizations who need to accelerate the development of their leaders call Eddie Turner, The Leadership Excelerator®. Eddie works with leaders to accelerate performance and drive impact. Call Eddie Turner to help your leaders one on one as their coach or to inspire them as a group through the power of facilitation or a keynote address. Visit EddieTurnerLLC.com to learn more.
Hey, this is Dave Sanderson. You may know me from being the last passenger US Airways Flight 1549, The Miracle on the Hudson from the movie Sally and you’re listening to the Keep Leading!® Podcast with Eddie Turner.
Eddie Turner:
All right, we’re back, everyone. I am talking to the amazing Lisa Spinelli. Lisa is a senior content manager for the Association for Talent Development and she’s the host of the Accidental Trainer Podcast.
Lisa, before the break we talked about communicating like a leader and now I want to switch gears a little bit. You aren’t just a journalist. You have taken things to a new level. I understand that you just completed your coach certification training.
Lisa Spinelli:
Yes, Eddie, you’re right. I just finished my George Mason University Coaching Program, so on my way to getting my ACC Certification.
Eddie Turner:
That is absolutely fantastic. The world needs more coaches and I know you’re going to be a phenomenal coach.
Lisa Spinelli:
Oh, thanks.
Eddie Turner:
Everyone who goes through coach training tells me that they’re never the same afterward. How did coach training change you as a communicator?
Lisa Spinelli:
Well, it definitely made me stop and think before I jump right in. I’m a very energetic type of personality. So, I definitely just jump right in a lot of the times when I feel like I have something to say or add to the situation. It really helped me to learn to take a pause, let people really say what they need to say and use those coactive listening skills. So, I think that that was definitely one aspect. And then trying not to because we all do have a lot of assessments in our heads, we have a lot of attachments and triggers and trying hard not to get triggered and have those emotional reactions and things like that pop out immediately after a trigger has happened when you’re talking to somebody. So, really taking different perspectives and taking a step back, I think, has definitely helped in my communication.
Eddie Turner:
It makes a big difference. I’ve been an ATD member for years but full disclosure, I guess I should say I’m not an ATD employee like you are but I am a contractor. So, ATD is one of my big clients and I facilitate the Global Coaching Certificate Program and I did that this week and I love that program. And when working with leaders who take it, they’re not necessarily people who want a coaching certification, they want the certificate but they want those coaching skills to use as leaders. And I always say in the program that the number one skill that a coach brings is their ability to listen. And, of course, we talk about the different layers of listening. So, it’s good to hear you say how that has impacted you and your ability to communicate as a leader.
Lisa Spinelli:
Yes, definitely. And I think that the core competencies that ICF really lists out, there are eight of them, and I really thought about this and how they kind of translate to communication and I think they really do. If you really stop and think about it, we’re talking about transparency, authenticity which a lot of people think “Oh, you’re being authentic and transparent” when you’re just basically telling all but no, it’s really about just being honest about who you are and staying true to your values, leading with heart. I think there’s a lot to all of the competencies. So, I don’t want to like go through maybe every single one, there are so many, but providing that safe and trusted environment, I think, right now is one of the biggest things that leaders could do. There’s so much uncertainty right now and providing that psychological safety to your employees and letting them know that they can come to you with any concern, I think, is going to be one of the best parts of these kinds of core competencies that ICF lays out that could be translated over to leadership right now.
Eddie Turner:
I love the fact you’re making this connection because I don’t know if I necessarily looked at it that way but you’re absolutely right. The ICF competencies really are underpinned by communication skills, both verbal and non-verbal, because a lot of times, of course, when we’re talking about listening, we’re talking about listening to what the client has not said.
Lisa Spinelli:
That’s right. Those somatic cues and their expressions and reading between the lines and paying attention really to that whole person, I think, is so key, especially now because we’re virtual, we don’t know what’s going on with people in their lives and what they’re dealing with. There are so many different boats that people are in. We all went through this together but we all went in very different boats. So, I think everybody’s coming across to the shore on the other side and some people are a little bit more wrangled than others. So, yeah, I think providing the safety that that we just talked about and really putting some of these competencies into play is going to help a lot of organizations out there.
Eddie Turner:
Absolutely It’s so true and, again, now more than ever as we’re at the end of this pandemic, hopefully, and coming out trying to get to the other side. I saw a meme that said it beautifully. It says “People begin to heal once they feel heard.”
Lisa Spinelli:
That’s beautiful. Yeah, I like that.
Eddie Turner:
And so, it just really underscores using the communication skill of listening and not necessarily the communication skill of speaking.
Lisa Spinelli:
Definitely. Yeah, it reminds me of this study that I had looked at back but when I had started the coaching program. I think, it was in like 2015 or 2016. It was a pretty small study, to be honest, but they had these evaluators that were looking at MRIs of people’s brains and seeing when someone was coactively listening to them, what was happening. And the reward sections of their brains were firing off. And I thought that was just so interesting that when someone is listening to you, you actually feel rewarded almost like it’s a treat.
Eddie Turner:
Isn’t that special?
Lisa Spinelli:
Yeah. It’s really beautiful that all you have to do is just really be there, you just be there, listen to somebody, actually listen, and they feel respected, they feel valued, it’s crazy that they feel rewarded by your gift of time.
Eddie Turner:
And it is a reward. It is the biggest gift I say in the program. It’s the biggest gift that we can give to another human being because in our 24×7, hyper-stimulated, digital technological society, people very often do not give themselves the gift of silence and they certainly don’t necessarily get the gift of having someone listen to them and give them their full presence. And so, it truly is a gift.
Lisa Spinelli:
Very, true.
Eddie Turner:
Now, Lisa, you are also the host of the Accidental Trainer Podcast for ATD. Tell us about the podcast.
Lisa Spinelli:
Oh, yeah. I enjoy doing the podcast. As you know, it’s so much fun. One of the reasons why I got into journalism is just that I love to meet people, I love to hear their stories, I love everything about stories and people. So, getting to interview people that I would never maybe have come across otherwise and learning their stories and, of course, we list out expertise that they have, tips and tricks for people who have fallen into this wonderful world of training and talent development. So, we have people that come on from all walks of that field. We have e-learning professionals and brain scientists all the way to instructional designers and coaches. So, yeah, Eddie, we’re going to have to get you on there so that we can fulfill the big circle of life here.
Eddie Turner:
Well, see, I was trying to just keep you on the other side of the mic this time since you’re always conducting the interviews. We’re kind of flipping the script on you today.
Lisa Spinelli:
Yeah, it’s fun. I love it.
Eddie Turner:
Well, you’ve moved from the Accidental Trainer Podcast to also adding author to your list of titles and accomplishments. So, tell us about your new book.
Lisa Spinelli:
Oh, thank you so much. Yes, the Teachers to Trainers book, we started to look at people who were entering into the field of talent development. And naturally there are a lot of teachers because, as you can imagine, K through 12 teachers have a lot of transferable skills to teaching adults. So, we put together a list of people that are contributors for different chapters of the book and reached out to them and got their stories, their transitions, what they wish they had known. And so, it was put together and published in October of 2020 and just really, I’m hoping for it to be a good resource for teachers out there. We know a lot of teachers are leaving the field right now. They’re looking for new and different opportunities but looking to keep their skills. And there just honestly aren’t a ton of resources for teachers who are looking to make their exit.
Eddie Turner:
Well, you’ve provided a fine resource for them. Again, the title of the book is Teachers to Trainers: Apply Your Passion and Skills to A New Career, available on paperback form as well as Kindle and amazon.com and the Association for Talent Development’s bookstore.
Lisa, I’ve enjoyed our conversation. What’s the main message you’d like our listeners to take away from our time together?
Lisa Spinelli:
I would say that the main message is that if you’re not sure if you’re communicating effectively with your team and you’re not really sure if there’s room for improvement there, there probably is. And if you’re looking to learn more about a coaching communication style, I would direct everybody to look at the ICF Core Competencies and, of course, check out ATD and find out more about how they can communicate effectively.
Eddie Turner:
Indeed. And ATD and ICF are different organizations but sister organizations and collaborate in a lot of ways and on different programs.
Wonderful. Thank you for sharing that. And as a leader, is there a piece of advice or quote you use that helps you to keep leading?
Lisa Spinelli:
Oh sure, yeah. I really love, I mean, she has a million followers, so it’s not like this is going to be original here but Brené Brown. I love her quote on “Integrity is choosing courage over comfort.” She also has a great one about “Being passionate about listening as much as you are about being heard.” So, I think that really fits right here in our communication really. Be passionate about listening and it’s amazing the rewards that you are giving people just by being there.
Eddie Turner:
“Be as passionate about listening as you are about wanting to be heard.” I love that. Good. Lisa, where can my listeners learn more about you?
Lisa Spinelli:
Well, you can definitely find me at ATD.org and I have my podcast also on the website at ATD.org but it’s a little bit tougher to find on the website now that we went through redesign. So, it’s ATDPodcast.Libsyn.com. And, of course, you can find me on LinkedIn.
Eddie Turner:
Excellent. I’m going to encourage everyone to follow you on LinkedIn, also go to Apple Podcast and just type ATD and you’ll find her podcast there. Listen to her podcast, follow Lisa and stay connected.
Lisa, thank you so much for being an incredible guest and helping us understand how to communicate as a leader so we can keep leading.
Lisa Spinelli:
Thank you so much, Eddie. It was such a pleasure to be here and you’re such a fun host.
Eddie Turner:
Thank you. I appreciate you, Lisa.
That concludes this episode, everyone. This is Eddie Turner, The Leadership Excelerator®, reminding you that leadership is not about our position or our title. Leadership is an activity. Leadership is action. It’s not the case of once a leader, always a leader. It’s not a garment we put on and take off. We must be a leader at our core and allow it to emanate in all we do. So, whatever you’re doing, always keep leading.
Thank you for listening to your host Eddie Turner on the Keep Leading!® Podcast. Please remember to subscribe to the Keep Leading!® Podcast on iTunes or wherever you listen. For more information about Eddie Turner’s work, please visit EddieTurnerLLC.com.
Thank you for listening to C Suite Radio, turning the volume up on business.
The Keep Leading!® podcast is for people passionate about leadership. It is dedicated to leadership development and insights. Join your host Eddie Turner, The Leadership Excelerator® as he speaks with accomplished leaders and people of influence across the globe as they share their journey to leadership excellence. Listen as they share leadership strategies, techniques and insights. For more information visit eddieturnerllc.com or follow Eddie Turner on Twitter and Instagram at @eddieturnerjr. Like Eddie Turner LLC on Facebook. Connect with Eddie Turner on LinkedIn.
